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Post by Jon Alden on Jun 11, 2013 19:06:06 GMT -5
His underline is more like a V and less like a gravy bowl which I would like to see. Also I would like more depth in his tail.
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Post by crystalwhite on Jun 11, 2013 20:37:14 GMT -5
Thanks Jon i appreciate you pointing out his faults so i can improve upon them. David
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Post by Jon Alden on Jun 11, 2013 22:10:40 GMT -5
David, I do like his length of body, and it looks like he has good width also.
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Post by d12chandler on Jun 13, 2013 18:44:02 GMT -5
It looks like he isn't standing straight up, that could made a difference. He's about to big for the cage, which is good. Nice bird.
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Post by crystalwhite on Jun 13, 2013 19:57:07 GMT -5
Thanks Don, He is not standing straight up.Here is a better pic of him let me know what you think. David Attachments:
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Post by d12chandler on Jun 15, 2013 20:46:25 GMT -5
I think you are sure going in the right direction. Did you have any luck on raising any out of my females.
don
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Post by lildinkem on Jun 16, 2013 12:51:04 GMT -5
Davy you are doin great. Your male should make some very nice Whites. Not too easy in the USA to get the better White Orps breeders to let go their stock. I was very lucky to have Harry as a friend who shared one of his best males with me to use last season. Harry's line has Alan Ammarell lines and Cecil Moore lines. I am very good friends with Alan. At any given moment I can pick up the phone and give him a call IF I like. I usually just trade emails. Even Alan will not share any of his Whites with me. But, he even said to me I have his line thru Harry's nice cock. I am sure in the future Alan and I will be doing more then trading emails. He told me that when the day comes that he is ready to share some of his Whites with anyone outside his network of friends I was at the top of the list. Very nice fella. I been on another of the better White Orp breeders list to get birds. Sometimes you need to be patient. Work with what we have. Seeing that most of the Whites in our country that are Exhibition quality have similar blood and there are only a handful of them here in the states worth using the blood they have makes it an effort to work outside the box when building a White Orp. I treasure the White cock Harry let me have. Along with giving many thanks for helping I need also to give Doug huge thanks for turning me onto his Boone County 4-H Club friends. Both Joyce and Ron have been a great help. The Pontious's too shared with me some of their White Orp blood before they sold them off. I have 2 very nice Pontious pullets to use with one of the sons of Harry's cock. This White cockerel is from Ron Patterson's Grand Champion line of White Wyandottes. He let me have a few single comb White Wyandotte pullets last season to use. The evidence of his quality is seen in what I have with some killer quality tails coming out in some of my White chicks from those hens. IF not for Harry & the Boone County 4-H Club folks I would be working for years to make what I have made just this season with these White birds I have the pleasure to play with. IF I did not have Harry's, Ron's, Joyce's or Gayle's birds to play around with I would be scratching my head to build an Orps looking birds from totally out of the box breeding. One of my plans was to breed my Silver Cuckoo to my 2 Buff Columbian hens. I was told by Marvin, a friend who is a genetics know it all and resides in the country of Columbia, it is possible to make a Silver from this breeding. And ofcourse Marvin is correct. I had this Silver Cuckoo cockerel in with my Buff Columbians together rite before I set up breeding pens. I hatched out about a dozen, give or take, and low and behold I got something that looks like a White bird with the genetics to use to make Orps IF I did not have such reliable friends like Harry and the 4-H gang to help me. This is proof of Marvin's wisdom. Not just one but two White birds. IF this pullet did not have Blue legs I may have not believed it was possible. She and one of her full brothers are in this pic, and I mean the White Columbian cockerel just behind her. I really like his front. The genetics is there to make nice large full rounded breast White Orps Their daddy the Silver Cuckoo. Just look at his width and that is now inherit in these birds. Boy, I would like to see more of him in some White Orps. I guess some of last season's White pullets may have to get some time in with him. His son from that breeding to the Buff Columbian had me thinking WHERE did I get a White Orp from. He is from the Silver Cuckoo and the Buff Sports. They look and have identical features. I really would not like to have to use him IF not for Harry and the Boone County 4-H Clubs help However, I do have Harry's and the friends of Boone County 4-H Club birds to use. A nice start to this season with who knows where this may lead me. As Doug's mmentor told me, I have some Whites that look like Orps and this is my first season of breeding. I should and am very pleased what is coming out from this line I am making. The line is the: Shaffer/Boone County 4-Her Whites. IF Harry or the folks in Boone County 4-H Club ever want any from me they know it will be theirs and "FREE"! Size is inherit was one of the questions Alan asked me when it comes to breeding for size. Alan knows all. Dang Harry you and Alan have some killer nice heads your lines have me able to incorporate into making a White Orp. And this chick was from early April hatch. YIKES!!! How big can this girl or prolly boy get? Little guys from the 2nd wave I just put outside 2 weeks ago.
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Post by lildinkem on Jun 17, 2013 16:35:23 GMT -5
Something to consider when you build a flock of chickens not just Orps. 2 of my mentors and very best poultry friends, Harry & Larry Lee both like to see their bird retain their instinctive broody trait. Last season I had 14 White pullets. One died and am down to 13. 10 are in with Harry's cock. 6 outta the 10 are broody. 3 are in with my #2 White cockerel. 2 outta 3 there are broody. I know both Harry and Lee really appreciate a line which has broodiness inherit in them. Now, I have my #1 White cockerel as seen below in with 2 Pontious hens, 2 of my Fuesting Buff Sports and my 1 nice girl from my buddy up north. None of them have shown any remote interest in being broody. So, I hope to ad that into the mix when they get bred by this boy. I also know this fella is no where as nice as Davy's boy. My boy is from my White Wyandotte girl from last season. I know that Silver will clean out any brassiness. This was told to me by both Harry, and Doug. Doug's White Rocks have never shown any brassiness, and these Patterson White Wyandottes have Doug's Rock in them. Ron too has said he has no issues with brassiness. So, the hope is to eliminate that color trait from my Buff Sports and he will not hurt the color to both the Postious hens and the my buddies White hen. So, breeding is fun when you have friends who let you use quality birds like these. My boy from Harry's cock and the White Wyandotte, he does not have the full rounded breast that I like but these 5 girls have it. Should make some nice babies for next season.
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Post by lildinkem on Jul 7, 2013 17:54:03 GMT -5
Updated pic of the gangly cockerel. I was very close to culling him. Now, I may give him another 6 months. He is still very tight feathered. I can deal with that down the road. His sister is right behind him. He is an early March hatch.
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Post by crystalwhite on Jul 14, 2013 9:45:05 GMT -5
Hello everyone he is a pic of one of my white cockerels he is pretty nice.Wanted to know what you thought of him.he is 7 months old.He has the best tail out of all my white males.
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Post by lildinkem on Jul 15, 2013 9:18:47 GMT -5
Hello everyone he is a pic of one of my white cockerels he is pretty nice.Wanted to know what you thought of him.he is 7 months old.He has the best tail out of all my white males. Davy does this boy have UK White Orp blood in him? He has the UK style of topline back. IF you are going the UK direction, I think he is pretty nice boy to work with. One thing you need to remember, no matter who it is, one must know where they want to go with an outcross breeding. Many of our USA Orp lines are very closely related. It is necessary for some to go outside a given line to make more Orps. I had to do this with whites cause I only had Harry's white cock to use. It is not easy to get the quality Whites from some breeders. They seem to be very picky who they let their Whites go. Now if you wanting to make APA or USA style Orps, you may want to take the top back line and more level it off. The UK folks like their Orps to have a "U" shape on the topline. American lines like a flat level back. I prefer smaller wattles and combs. The birds I am making were from taking Harry's cock to some White Wyandottes who have single combs. So, that breeding has given me nice flat backs with a good tail angle and smaller wattles and combs. The other line I took him too is Joyce's Buff Sports. Do not need to do much there except weed out those with a yellowish color. Now since I did not get anyone other then Gayle to get me some Whites to use with Harry's cock, I wanted to make sure I did not over load my gene pool. So, I did use them in the beginning of the season. From now on I am concentrating to just the two lines I mentioned. Even if the line you have has great birds when you outcross you can easily muck them up with each line's non desirable traits. Here is a pullet who is daughter to the big Cuckoo and Gayle's old White line. I now need to focus the best offspring back to each other to weed out the bad and work with the good. I really like the size Gayle's Whites and my monster Cuckoo have made. Now I need your White boy's fluff. Gayle said the fluff is passed down thru the male side. So, be careful with what you outcross breed. Once you do it take the offspring back to each other to re-concentrate the genetics of the good parts of these birds to move on. So, in a nut shell Davy, your very young, be patient and do smart breeding. By the time your 30 you will have the best Whites in the country. You can tell this pullet is from the Cuckoo cause of her Blue tinted leg skin. Gayle said the leg skin color comes from the male side, so I would need to take this girl back to a White skinned boy. Now this boy is from Gayle's line crossed onto Harry's. Concentrating the genes from Gayle's line should clean up the leg color and re-enforce the size and breast. For some they may not have any quality in their Orps. They then need to first build up an Orpy type line. When doing that, you do not care what color the bird is. Even, if I dare say, they have barring you should first build the Orp traits with your best birds. I use this pic as an illustration of how much a non standard Orp can contribute to a person's breeding program. Again, this is if you bought nothing but lousy stock from breeders who have not got a clue of how to make Orps. There are many out there, just browse thru EBAY on a given afternoon and see the cr@p that is being sold. A 4 & 1/2 month old.
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Post by harrys on Jul 15, 2013 9:50:21 GMT -5
Bill, That non standard cuckoo cockerel is very impressive. He looks a lot more promising to make a crele than some I have seen out there being offered. Don;t you have a BBR project hen hiding anywhere?
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Post by harrys on Jul 15, 2013 9:50:32 GMT -5
Double post too many programs that keep updating.
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Post by crystalwhite on Jul 15, 2013 12:13:39 GMT -5
Hello Bill yes this boy has the english blood in him.I like the APA style white orp better.Here are some pis of old time USA white orps this is what i want. Attachments:
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Post by lildinkem on Jul 15, 2013 15:23:36 GMT -5
Harry he is first week of March hatch, he barely 5 months old. I'd like to see what he looks like in a year. A monster in the making. That BBR hen turned 5 years old this spring. She just passed about a month ago. Now what would happen if I take him bake to his Buff Columbian mom? Davy, I do not blame you. 100 years ago there would be 8,000 entries for the Orpington Nationals. now 80 is a good turn out. Here is a pic DaveK sent me. A classic 40's era show winning quality White cock.
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